Color filter

[ldg40]

If you convert an image to grayscale, using the filter, will the colors pass as a two color image? ie: Black and white.

I hope this question isn't too stupid! (I am using Illustrator 10.03)

[Dave]

Greyscale is 256 color not 2 .... don't know about illustrator

[ldg40]

Yep Dave, me neither! Just seems that it would convert to shades of black and shades of white. Each of which is considered a color on it's own......?

[Dave]

I don't know what filter your talking about and there are so many ways to convert an image to grayscale (or greyscale even) all I know is that there are 256 shades of gray (well 254 + black + white to be precise). A grey shade or color is a color with equal amounts of Red, Blue and Green.

[Scott]

Dave's misinformed. Or just thinking in terms of the web and not print.


Black and white is considered 1 color because you would print black ink on white stock. So the answer is no.. it's not two color, it's one color.

There is no such thing as shades of white. White is white. You can't lighten it up any. It's shades of black that create grey. So you print black ink. The varying opacities of the black ink create the greys.

[Dave]

Going off on the wrong tangent again. Story of my life. :)

[ldg40]

[QUOTE=Jolt]
Black and white is considered 1 color because you would print black ink on white stock. So the answer is no.. it's not two color, it's one color.

There is no such thing as shades of white. White is white. You can't lighten it up any. It's shades of black that create grey. So you print black ink. The varying opacities of the black ink create the greys.[/QUOTE]


The old woman renouned for stupid questions, knows white is one color and black is one color, wha-la! Two colors for printing. BUT, does the Illustrator filter, "convert to grayscale" turn an image into just two colors (blk & wht)....or does it ad some funky shade of something or does it truely stay true? Or does it just use black and shades of? If it just uses black and shades of, then I am thinking I can add another color (staying again with just a two color design). When I do convert it, looks to me I see white. Which would rule out being able to add another color......

Just so you know, I've read this post back to myself....and all I can say is, I'm sorry. :o

[Scott]

Unless you're printing on stock that requires white ink, such as black stock, white never counts as a color. Ever. Ever. So a black and white image is only one color.

To be honest..... I've never in my life used the convert to greyscale command in Illustrator. I have Photoshop. If I need a greyscale image for Illustrator and all I have is a color image, I use Photoshop to make a greyscale image. There's far more control over it in Photoshop than there will ever be in Illustrator.

Or.. I had a thought... are you using the filter to convert colors on existing vector elements?


If yes, then yes it actually converts it to greyscale.. meaning one color. It's a solid feature and you shouldn't be afraid of it.

[ldg40]

This will be used for screen printing, which I should have clarified to start with. Thats why I assumed that I needed to count Blk & Wht as an individual colors. So am I way off base here?

BTW, I started this whole design in Illustrator as the great Jolt suggested it should be done. I just wanted this one to be right and not beg for someone to fix it in the end! Thank you so much for the help, advice and wisdom!! :)

[Scott]

Ahhha! Screen printing on a dark shirt would include white as a color then. So yes, it would be two colors... unless it's a black shirt.. then it's only one color (white and varying opacities of white would create grey). Screen printing is different :)

I'd really hesitate to do too many tonal variations for screen printing though. If it were me I'd really try to stick to 100% and 50% tints only. a 10% screen could be very hard to hold when silkscreening.

[ldg40]

Excellent Jolt! Thank you! Thats what I thought!

This job is turning more difficult than I thought. I have been just given the okay to go blk & wht. Why? Because this design will be use on every imaginable color of clothing. It was my suggestion to do so. But, like you have said, being constricted to just a 50% (at most) opacity, loses a whole lot of drama. I'm starting to stress pretty big now. The client wants 3 designs, for the same place, 3 different themes..... I just despise such color restrictions, but financially, I completely understand!

Again thank you....and I suppose that even if the Illustrator filters is true to its name, I assume it will use blk & wht with much lower shades of opacity than 50%. grrrr...

[QUOTE=Jolt]

Or.. I had a thought... are you using the filter to convert colors on existing vector elements?


If yes, then yes it actually converts it to greyscale.. meaning one color. It's a solid feature and you shouldn't be afraid of it.[/QUOTE]


I've just re-read your post (wasn't paying attention, my WONDERFULl husband was feeding me supper) This is exactly my intention, to only change vector elements. Oh! This could change everything! So if it's changing it to grayscale...meaning one color...I can add one more color? say it so!!

[Scott]

Well if you're printing on say a red shirt... and you MUST have a white area... then no.... it convert it to two colors. Illustrator sees white as transparent. So be careful, you'll actually have to build a color to use for white. So if you want a black and white ink.. you're going to have to create white ink elements. Not just use the white of the artboard.

Here's an easy way to look at it while you create.
Make a new layer in Illustrator. Draw a rectangle that covers the entire artboard. Fill the rectangle with a random shirt color.. red, blue, purple... whatever. Now move the layer below all other layers and lock it. So.... any element you create must work on that color. So if you want white ink you need to create a white element. You can't just use the page transparency (which is white by default) as your white ink. This also means that any element that does not match the shirt color counts as a color.

[ldg40]

[QUOTE=Jolt]
Here's an easy way to look at it while you create.
Make a new layer in Illustrator. Draw a rectangle that covers the entire artboard. Fill the rectangle with a random shirt color.. red, blue, purple... whatever. Now move the layer below all other layers and lock it. So.... any element you create must work on that color. So if you want white ink you need to create a white element. You can't just use the page transparency (which is white by default) as your white ink. This also means that any element that does not match the shirt color counts as a color.[/QUOTE]

Great, I mean super-duper tip!! I will incorpoate this idea as soon as I hit "submit reply"! :)

Thanks again Jolt!

[Dave]

Dave's going to be having words with his old school science teachers.

:"poke":

[ldg40]

Indeed Dave! This whole vector/raster, screenprint & not stuff, is greek to me & very scientific... Now I know why the REAL proffesionals make so much "cha-ching"!!

[reddaisy]

the real professionals ask around a lot and try to avoid problems beforehand: which is exactly what you are doing right now, pro ;) !

BTW I assume you know about spot colours and global colours? Its an easy way to make a white that will be printed when colour separated

success
tom